Delta Transatlantic Economy Review: New York (JFK) to Paris (CDG) on the 767-400ER

Rating: 3/5 (Mediocre food and service. Also Delta’s 767s are ancient and about as old as me)

Route: DL262 JFK-CDG (depart 7:30PM arrive 9:30AM +1 Day)

Price: 32,000 Delta Skypesos (and $5.60 in taxes) that I transferred from my American Express Platinum (around a ~1.6 cent per point redemption)

Introduction

For an impromptu summer trip, I needed a cheap way to get to Paris. After a quick scan of seats.aero, I thought the cheapest way to Paris from NYC was on Delta. However, I learned the hard way that Delta actually displays it lowest advertised price in miles for basic economy. To get regular economy, which is kind of important for seat selection on a transatlantic redeye, you have to pay ~50% (!) more. I hope other airlines don’t start doing this type of pricing, but unfortunately that’s where the industry is heading. Unbundled pricing / revenue maximization for everything.

Regardless, I transferred 21,000 Amex points and then realized I had to top-up, which made what I thought was a good last-minute redemption not as great. A reminder to always check pricing thoroughly before transferring your points. Regular economy fares in peak summer between JFK and CDG go for $900-$1,100, so this one-way redemption was probably worth ~$500, or ~1.6 cents per point, which is still decent. Even though not the most aspirational booking, this shows why you should never really redeem your points for cash if you travel with any frequency. The easiest option is the one that Amex wants you to choose! Don’t leave your money on the table.

I wasn’t too excited for the flight itself but more so excited to check out the lounges in JFK’s Terminal 4. Terminal 4 probably has the highest density of great lounges of any US airport terminal, many of which I’ve visited: the Amex Centurion Lounge, Chase Sapphire Lounge, 2 Delta Skyclubs, an incredible Capital One Lounge, a new Delta One lounge, and a couple of priority pass options. It’s pretty crazy how many lounges are here; although it is kind of needed, because T4 is always packed. Specifically with some of the most premium / heavy spending passengers in the US (every other person passing through JFK T4 probably has one of the premium travel credit cards). See here for my post on the best credit card lounge at JFK (it’s Capital One).

Ground Experience at Terminal 4 JFK

I visited two lounges before my flight. First, I went to the Delta Skyclub by the A gates. Note there’s two Delta Skyclubs at JFK (one in concourse A, one in B). The A gates location is much quieter, has decent food, and most importantly has an awesome outdoor deck which is great for summertime planespotting. See here for my review of this lounge; I was able to get in because I was flying Delta and have the American Express Platinum card.

More importantly, I also had time to check out the Capital One lounge at JFK, which is relatively new. This lounge is absurdly nice, probably the nicest credit card lounge in the US. There’s a full service bar, a bagel / coffee station (with made-to-order Ess-a-bagel), and made-to-order food you can order by QR code to wherever you’re seated. See my review of the Capital One Venture X here if you’re considering getting the card.

Quick Note on Delta’s 767s and Seat Map

Back to the flight. Today, my flight was being operating by Delta’s 767-400ER. This aircraft is old. Basically as old as me. Delta’s 767-400s were delivered in the 2000-2002 window. And they’re still flying, ~26 years later. Delta currently operates 21 of this aircraft subtype, with United operating the rest.

And these aircraft feel old. The engines are loud, cabin tech and humidity is much worse than A350/787s for long haul flying, the windows are small, and the cabin is showing its wear despite seat retrofits. So why does Delta fly them? As you’d expect: money. Most of these aircraft are fully depreciated, meaning that accountants never expected them to flying this long. This means financially, the aircraft themselves are “free” to operate, and only require variable costs (fuel, crew, maintenance). While they are more expensive to operate than more efficient newer aircraft, it still nets out to be wildly profitable for Delta, especially on high-volume / premium-heavy transatlantic routes. While Delta plans to phase these jets out eventually, they are in no rush to do so.

Here’s the economy seat map on their 767-400ER. These aircraft are pretty high-density for a 767 (especially compared to United’s ultra-premium 767s). One nice thing about 767s is that their economy is laid out in a 2 x 3 x 2 configuration, which is great if you’re traveling with someone. I was traveling alone, but it still makes it nice because there’s only one person who needs to climb over you to go to the bathroom.

I was in Seat 51F for today’s flight:

Seats on Delta’s 767-400ER are configured in the following setup:

34 Delta One seats (Thompson Vantage seats) in a 1 x 2 x 1 config

20 Premium Economy seats (Collins MiQ) in a 2 x 2 x 2 config

184 Economy seats (Collins Aerospace Meridian) in a 2 x 3 x 2 config

Flight and Service Review

On to the flight. Luckily, summer weather today was perfect (thunderstorms are a menace to the northeast corridor during the summer, especially to NYC airspace which has zero slack). Boarding began around an hour before departure.

Today’s flight was entirely full, and bordering was fairly orderly. I was in Zone 6 for boarding (no Delta status, just a regular economy award ticket).

The economy cabin on Delta’s 767 looks … old.

Here was my home for the next 8 hours:

Note this aircraft is in a 2 x 3 x 2 configuration in economy, which is the primary upside of flying the 767. There’s only one middle seat per row.

Here’s the cabin from above in economy:

I’m 6’2 and legroom in regular economy is tolerable at 32 inches of pitch. Not ideal for an 8 hour overnight flight, but I did spend $5.60 out of pocket for this flight so no complaints.

Dinner service began around an hour and a half after takeoff. I found Delta’s economy food pretty tolerable. I wasn’t too hungry, though, since I had gorged myself at the Capital One Lounge at JFK a few hours prior.

Shortly after the meal service, lights were turned off for cruise:

The bathroom looked pretty rough after a few hours:

After a movie and a few hours of half-sleep, we were approaching Paris. For breakfast, we were served “Mediterranean Calzones.” These were actually quite good.

We landed in warm and sunny Paris, but unfortunately were greeted by a remote gate. I didn’t mind, because it was nice out and it meant great planespotting.

Conclusion (and off to Paris & Lyon)

Overall, Delta economy was ~fine~. For 32,000 Skymiles and $5.60, it’s not a steal by any means but was a decent enough flight for the price. Seatback entertainment was fine, food decent, and seat was comfortable enough for an 8 hour flight (although probably not for anything longer). Next stop: Paris and Lyon.